my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist ORIGINAL POST: I posted a message on Twitter yesterday stating I thought The Beastie Boys and TopSpin Media "got it right" regarding how to sell music in this day and age. Here's a link to their store: http://illcommunication.beastieboys.com/buy_ic/ Shortly thereafter, I got some responses from people stating the usual "yeah, if you're an established artist - what if you're just trying to get heard?" argument. In an interview I did recently this topic came up and I'll reiterate what I said here. If you are an unknown / lesser-known artist trying to get noticed / established: * Establish your goals. What are you trying to do / accomplish? If you are looking for mainstream super-success (think Lady GaGa, Coldplay, U2, Justin Timberlake) - your best bet in my opinion is to look at major labels and prepare to share all revenue streams / creative control / music ownership. To reach that kind of critical mass these days your need old-school marketing muscle and that only comes from major labels. Good luck with that one. If you're forging your own path, read on. * Forget thinking you are going to make any real money from record sales. Make your record cheaply (but great) and GIVE IT AWAY. As an artist you want as many people as possible to hear your work. Word of mouth is the only true marketing that matters. To clarify: Parter with a TopSpin or similar or build your own website, but what you NEED to do is this - give your music away as high-quality DRM-free MP3s. Collect people's email info in exchange (which means having the infrastructure to do so) and start building your database of potential customers. Then, offer a variety of premium packages for sale and make them limited editions / scarce goods. Base the price and amount available on what you think you can sell. Make the packages special - make them by hand, sign them, make them unique, make them something YOU would want to have as a fan. Make a premium download available that includes high-resolution versions (for sale at a reasonable price) and include the download as something immediately available with any physical purchase. Sell T-shirts. Sell buttons, posters... whatever. Don't have a TopSpin as a partner? Use Amazon for your transactions and fulfillment. http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?ie=UTF8&nodeId=200229160 Use TuneCore to get your music everywhere. http://www.tunecore.com/ Have a realistic idea of what you can expect to make from these and budget your recording appropriately. The point is this: music IS free whether you want to believe that or not. Every piece of music you can think of is available free right now a click away. This is a fact - it sucks as the musician BUT THAT'S THE WAY IT IS (for now). So... have the public get what they want FROM YOU instead of a torrent site and garner good will in the process (plus build your database). The Beastie Boys' site offers everything you could possibly want in the formats you would want it in - available right from them, right now. The prices they are charging are more than you should be charging - they are established and you are not. Think this through. The database you are amassing should not be abused, but used to inform people that are interested in what you do when you have something going on - like a few shows, or a tour, or a new record, or a webcast, etc. Have your MySpace page, but get a site outside MySpace - it's dying and reads as cheap / generic. Remove all Flash from your website. Remove all stupid intros and load-times. MAKE IT SIMPLE TO NAVIGATE AND EASY TO FIND AND HEAR MUSIC (but don't autoplay). Constantly update your site with content - pictures, blogs, whatever. Give people a reason to return to your site all the time. Put up a bulletin board and start a community. Engage your fans (with caution!) Make cheap videos. Film yourself talking. Play shows. Make interesting things. Get a Twitter account. Be interesting. Be real. Submit your music to blogs that may be interested. NEVER CHASE TRENDS. Utilize the multitude of tools available to you for very little cost of any - Flickr / YouTube / Vimeo / SoundCloud / Twitter etc. If you don't know anything about new media or how people communicate these days, none of this will work. The role of an independent musician these days requires a mastery of first hand use of these tools. If you don't get it - find someone who does to do this for you. If you are waiting around for the phone to ring or that A & R guy to show up at your gig - good luck, you're going to be waiting a while. Hope this helps, and I'll scour responses for intelligent comments I can respond to. TR TopSpin Media info: http://topspinmedia.com/for-artists/ (disclaimer) This was written on a bumpy Euro-bus ride across the wilderness - may ramble a bit but I think the point gets across. TR UPDATE 1: Thanks for the insightful comments already - when I get a moment (and a reliable internet connection) I'll respond to some of your very valid points. Please keep in mind - these were just some thoughts I quickly wrote down and posted and not meant to be a complete guide by any means. I've neglected to get into publishing and some other things. I'll update pretty soon. UPDATE 2: Here's a message from Ian Rogers of TopSpin http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,768581#msg-768581 UPDATE 3: Here's a few responses - more to come when I get time. [b]Bandcamp[/b] http://bandcamp.com/ This looks excellent to me. I have not used it but it appears to be great. This would cover your digital distribution of files and the collecting / amassing of your database. Looks like you'd still need someplace to handle fulfillment of merchandise / physical goods (like the Amazon link above). [b]Pay-what-you-want model[/b] This is where you offer tracks or albums for a user-determined price. I hate this concept, and here's why. Some have argued that giving music away free devalues music. I disagree. Asking people what they think music is worth devalues music. Don't believe me? Write and record something you really believe is great and release it to the public as a "pay-what-you-think-it's-worth" model and then let's talk. Read a BB entry from a "fan" rationalizing why your whole album is worth 50 cents because he only likes 5 songs on it. Trust me on this one - you will be disappointed, disheartened and find yourself resenting a faction of your audience. This is your art! This is your life! It has a value and you the artist are not putting that power in the hands of the audience - doing so creates a dangerous perception issue. If the FEE you are charging is zero, you are not empowering the fan to say this is only worth an insultingly low monetary value. Don't be misled by Radiohead's In Rainbows stunt. That works one time for one band once - and you are not Radiohead. [b]Why put something on iTunes for a price fans can get it from your site for free? Won't it piss people off?[/b] Do it and don't worry about it. Lots of people apparently shop at iTunes exclusively and that's where they get their music. They are generally not the people that would be mad to discover they could have gotten the same record (at a better bit-rate) for free elsewhere. We put The Slip up at nin.com for free at all fidelities and STILL sold a fairly large amount of copies at iTunes for $9.99. At the time iTunes did not allow variable pricing (I don't know what the deal is now). [b]My Flash comments[/b] I don't hate Flash, just go easy on it and avoid anything that takes time to load - ESPECIALLY your front page. [b]Managers / booking agents / small labels[/b] Any or all of these may be good for you - or not. Here's a truth: nobody knows what to do right now, me included. The music business model is broken right now. That means every single job position in the music industry has to re-educate itself and learn / discover / adapt a new way. Change can be painful and hard and scary. If any of these entities we're discussing are interested in you, ask them about their strategies IN DETAIL. None of them know for sure what to do. Some of them have an idea of how to negotiate these waters. Most of them don't. If you are young and use the internet, you know more about your audience than they do - for sure. This is a revolution and you can be a part of it. The old guard is dying, if you have good ideas - try them. Bottom line - before getting involved with anyone else, ask yourself what it is they can clearly bring to your table and is it worth their cut. Do they know what they're talking about, and does their strategies match yours? I have not gotten into the basics which I believe are self-evident: believe in what you do, do the best work you can, work hard, practice, practice more, find your voice, hone in on it, take chances, play live (if applicable), practice more, keep believing in yourself and prepare for the long haul. http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,767183#msg-767183 Fri, 20 Nov 2009 22:54:29 -0800 Phorum 5.2.7 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,914044#msg-914044 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,914044#msg-914044 Following some kind of mental breakdown/breakthrough, call it as you like,
i started writing music again after not even touching it for 5 years. i wrote 63 songs in 3 days, and have nearly doubled that in the two weeks since.
my flow is moving faster than i can access resources, i do not want a band, but am willing to work projects with someone / people.

My problem, is that i have music coming out of me, faster than i can pile it together,
i know that some book publishers, will sign and grant people with only half a book written if it appears promising,
Are there things like this out there for music, and if there are, or would it suicide my career by tying myself down with that kind of ball and chain.

i am naive to the "old ways" that so many of you have referred to.
when i read the original post, i really couldn't understand why these things weren't already i suppose, common place to most people.
No insult to intelligence intended.

i am 25 years old, married, female. and i am not looking for red carpets. but i don't mind wiping my feet on them if that's where this takes me.

i have the drive, the patience the resolve, you name it, everything but the resources i need to bring what i am, to fruition.
hopefully someone with similar interests, or solutions/offers reads this.

my lyrics are poetic, my music reflects the decay of my generation,
and i want to share it all, and as much as i want to do it alone, i know i just dont have the necessary resources. I know it will take time, alot of time. its what i will do with the rest of my life.

I need a safe place to post lyrical content for input and exposure.
i hope it isnt against the rules to do this,
but here is my email, if anyone would like to make suggestions, maybe even explore working together, i live near seattle. My email is Dusky_cobalt_blues@hotmail.com

please, feel free to email me.]]> madamereuby Music Mon, 26 Oct 2009 17:36:32 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,911277#msg-911277 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,911277#msg-911277
I'm set to release my first album around February/March next year, and leading up to it I have a giant convoluted campaign to try and get people interested but I'm worried that it might not be enough.]]> lucidedge Music Fri, 23 Oct 2009 12:11:06 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,904146#msg-904146 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,904146#msg-904146 eaton86 Music Sat, 17 Oct 2009 11:27:53 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,900905#msg-900905 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,900905#msg-900905
Recorded music isn't some magical thing that happens anymore. Everyone and their dog records music. There is also a HUGE range of music everywhere. It's causing more noise pollution than really anything else.

I think that in a few years time, people will get tired of listening to other peoples' music. We've resorted to things like Venetian Snares for originality, that's pretty horrible even though he's a great programmer. Everything else is a "revival" and done for "style" in a mass consumer culture which people are getting fed up with as the days go on.

I think it's bound to return to families or a group of friends just playing amongst themselves as something for mere entertainment. More people are taught or learn music now with easier access to information, than even a few years ago. They're encouraged to take it in general education as it compliments mathematics and science, especially the digital media stuff. I think it's probably going to end up kind of like a 21st century campfire sort of thing, except anything goes and usually happens in the living room sometimes it's recorded sort of like someone using a handy cam to record a wedding.

I think the best idea in the mean time would be to create a site devoted to music based on individual scenes in a global area, sort of like a huge map you can click on and find bands in a certain area.

Do a album, record some shows, stick it all on an 8 gb flash drive, sell it for whatever.]]> thebinarycollective Music Tue, 13 Oct 2009 23:29:38 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,900178#msg-900178 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,900178#msg-900178 I am completely stoked about the idea of "making things". I have so many ideas - including a "bake-sale" concert (seems silly but I can make it work). The current shift in the industry is giving us musicians a chance to be who we REALLY are - smart, savvy, and capable people. So many people think of musicians as savants and one-trick ponies. We are so much more - often highly literate, logical, thrifty, resourceful, technologically competent, and compassionate. We WANT to reach out to people because we CAN. We are often also visually oriented - being great designers - or tactile - we can build stuff! I know many musicians who build their own guitars! The days of musicians sitting around a parlour practicing all day every day are over. We now have opportunities to be leaders in the world at large - to discuss our worldviews, and to promote the spiritual idea that people do not have to subscribe to constant labeling, but can instead open themselves to exploring their being, and allowing themselves to find what they like and don't like. We don't have to just promote music anymore - we can promote the CAUSE of music! I think of the Beatles, how their later records were released at a time when they had quit touring in order to explore their interests in other things; philosophy, world music, farming/agriculture, photography, activism, visual art, and even business!]]> dazednocturne Music Tue, 13 Oct 2009 11:53:37 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,894355#msg-894355 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,894355#msg-894355 TrashCityRockers posted:
what kind of help should you seek from indie labels, or do you think you are just as well to do the grunt work yourself? meaning is it even worth trying to get noticed by smaller label when the web offers most of the services they do, or is getting picked up by a a company with good connections/distribution the ultimate goal behind being an underground success?

Yeah, if Scotty Weiland doesn't O.D. by then]]> ROGUE STURGEON Music Wed, 07 Oct 2009 20:30:38 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,894029#msg-894029 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,894029#msg-894029 www.reverbnation.com]]]> nwojczak Music Wed, 07 Oct 2009 15:44:03 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,886306#msg-886306 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,886306#msg-886306 Queiroga_ Music Wed, 30 Sep 2009 11:13:48 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,880273#msg-880273 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,880273#msg-880273
I'm Deaf and I write music and sing too...not many people believe it. How can someone like myself get others to believe that yes, you can be "disabled" and still do something that is something you're not supposed to be able to do? I've had to take pictures of my hearing aids just to get others to believe that it really is true.

How do you market that?

a deaf fan,

S.]]> jasphiel Music Thu, 24 Sep 2009 13:00:58 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,879355#msg-879355 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,879355#msg-879355
I find it increasingly hard to pursue a career with my band as we get older. We've been together for over 12 years now (since 12 years old). The longer we play together the more it feels like we need money to take off; money for jam spaces, publicists, cd recording and manufacturing...

Needing more money means having an extra job which leaves less time for the band.

Is it necessary for a band to drop their jobs and do the starving musician thing full time?

Any thoughts?]]> beautifulnothingdotcom Music Wed, 23 Sep 2009 14:47:46 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,879071#msg-879071 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,879071#msg-879071
A good service to propose your music for free through streaming or direct download is Last.fm.

The result can be seen here [www.last.fm]]]> donegarden Music Wed, 23 Sep 2009 07:46:26 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,877758#msg-877758 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,877758#msg-877758
thank you for this golden nugget. its opened a lot of doors in my mind. <3]]> joshua christ Music Mon, 21 Sep 2009 21:59:56 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,855284#msg-855284 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,855284#msg-855284 Alright well, a couple months i ago i read this original post and it convinced me to simply give away the record. I set it up in a way where it requires for the people downloading to set up an account so that i could build up a mailing list, a fan base etc... My band is called obzcura. (The website is www.obzcura.com) Please check it out. You can download the record via torrent that we are giving away. Feel free to 'grade' my performance in executing these new theories.. constructive criticism is really appreciated you guys.

Thank You.]]> Obzcura Music Tue, 08 Sep 2009 19:04:12 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,854778#msg-854778 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,854778#msg-854778 ar7slu7 posted:
Would have the Pretty Hate Trent followed the Slippery Trent's advices?

Pretty Hate Trent had never imagined something like the internet.]]> Kid IRA1 Music Tue, 08 Sep 2009 12:22:55 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,851503#msg-851503 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,851503#msg-851503
Now I'm thinking shit, I gottta find some amature promoter/pusher to help spread my unknown music around the web....
I can program HTML and javascript fluently but most people are to stupid to make it to a free webpage EG: [www.freeadfilledwebpages.com] and I aint paying up for domain names ect.. till i get more people interested in my music. Thus I have sucummbed to the generic myspace band page, which sucks in a way because most people on your freinds list are your competition, just want to litter your comments, but it is good for recruiting fans, assisting non internet savy laymens to your page via myspace search features, plus you dont have to spend alot of time making your own cross browser multi platform homepage..

Any promotion volunteers here?

You can check my NIN profile to jump to my "generic" myspace, if your interested
Mainly check my freind EyeMgun, see what you think, we will likely merge completley soon unless hes just a multiple personality, seeing how I've never met him ect.. if your interested e-mail me preferably someone with digital imaging and web based programming skills but neither are required..]]> digitalenigma0 Music Sun, 06 Sep 2009 06:50:29 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,845983#msg-845983 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,845983#msg-845983 ar7slu7 Music Wed, 02 Sep 2009 22:30:49 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,845420#msg-845420 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,845420#msg-845420 'No frills thinking', I guess.

Having personally 'suffered' from going through the old music business model, with my band and productions ...in the not so distant past, ...I had indeed been wondering just what to do with the stuff I've been coming up with lately...
And here you are, talking absolute artistic sense.

Your approach clears the mind from fear, misconceptions, and I guess, the conditioning from old systems.

It is excellent, generous advice, and it really is about the future.

Thank you, good Sir.

thesparkingtoys]]> Evskis Music Wed, 02 Sep 2009 18:08:38 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,842155#msg-842155 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,842155#msg-842155
I suggest that artists look at Audiolife for a store solution / Tunecore for digi-distru / Soundcloud for remix and collabs / Wordpress for a site platform / iLike for iPhone APP - also look at MobileRoadie / the list goes on......

Some of the above can be seen at my site - I'd like to think that it's a good showcase of what's possible while being an 'indie artist'.

Access RWTV: www.ralphwatson.tv

http://www.ldnhost.com/client/rwtv/nin-link.jpg

Thanks,
RW]]> RW Music Mon, 31 Aug 2009 19:31:00 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,839310#msg-839310 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,839310#msg-839310 TrashCityRockers Music Sat, 29 Aug 2009 21:15:05 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,834488#msg-834488 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,834488#msg-834488
Eugene
www.myspace.com/euphoracle]]> eugenius79 Music Thu, 27 Aug 2009 01:05:07 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,816780#msg-816780 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,816780#msg-816780 I've bookmarked all the links he mentioned and will sign up. And to think, I thought myspace was enough!]]> orangeusername Music Sat, 15 Aug 2009 23:28:21 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,800378#msg-800378 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,800378#msg-800378 …Thank you Trent.

One of the thorns digging into my head still sometimes snaps some questions.

Should I let them turn my art into a product and let them feed their pockets with it…?
No, because I don’t think that art should be a product, despite that many things yield that it should.
And I really don’t know how much of my soul they might suck outta me, how much creative control they will want, how much censorship they will stick into, how many times they’ll try to turn me into something more suitable for them…
More importantly, how much they’ll try to change the face of what I portray or sing about?
I can still handle this.

And money making sucks…. No, not really, money buys food and stuff.

I mean my goal is not making money at all, but art is my life, I’m not a doctor or anything else…
If I don’t have money I can’t keep making art.
Just some fuel to keep the machine running….

A bit off the point….

Once that I have my art developed, solid thing… and still the only one that knows about its existence is me.
Here’s the rub… How do I make my art known and available to others…?

If something is free can be easily disposed and lacks of value?…
No, not always, it aint fucking tissues.

No one will buy it if it has a huge price attached to it since they don’t know what it is.
And the only ones able to do this are artists with a structure and fandom like thing.
I am not Radiohead… true.

So, how should I unleash it?
Samples, free… leaked to the world through mass communication tools controlled in almost all it’s entity by me.

Most of the other things are pointed by Reznor, this is a massive issue that fills my head nowadays, and despite that he stated that what he wrote were rumbling basic thoughts, to me are the sketches of a great picture.

Still some questions are itching…
Would they like it?
Would they not?
Are they ready for it?…
I wonder, but that’s what I’ll find about it sooner or later, yet, scheming and preparations are elements that will affect this.

“I have not gotten into the basics which I believe are self-evident: believe in what you do, do the best work you can, work hard, practice, practice more, find your voice, hone in on it, take chances, play live (if applicable), practice more, keep believing in yourself and prepare for the long haul.”

Indeed, this is not over yet.

Thanks again Trent.]]> DrSelfDestruct Music Sun, 02 Aug 2009 16:34:36 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,797888#msg-797888 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,797888#msg-797888 Steve Iorio
Blind Beatroot/ The Vagrants]]> blindbeatroot Music Thu, 30 Jul 2009 19:51:16 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,797872#msg-797872 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,797872#msg-797872
I'm close to taking action and sharing my music, but I've always felt overwhelmed with making a name for myself. I also wonder if anyone will even remotely enjoy my art.]]> Pavura Music Thu, 30 Jul 2009 19:35:00 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,797244#msg-797244 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,797244#msg-797244 trent_reznor posted:
ORIGINAL POST:
Word of mouth is the only true marketing that matters.



Have a realistic idea of what you can expect to make from these and budget your recording appropriately.



If you don't know anything about new media or how people communicate these days, none of this will work. The role of an independent musician these days requires a mastery of first hand use of these tools.



Here's a truth: nobody knows what to do right now, me included. The music business model is broken right now. That means every single job position in the music industry has to re-educate itself and learn / discover / adapt a new way. Change can be painful and hard and scary.

How word of mouth is the only true form of marketing, how true this is. I'm from Cleveland, and here when something is good [truly good] it won't take long before more views, more plays, more sales...more fans. I agree with you.


On making realistic goals on revenue and knowing your budget, it doesn't take a lot of money nowadays to create, how you get it out there may only come down to you distributing it [so, one shouldn't be lazy either-work hard towards something you want, and in time...it will come]. Give yourself at least a year of balls-to-the-wall hard-work, pure-hustle. *wink*

Learning the tools of the trade should be the first thing one does before jumping the starting line[this gives you time to really connect and know the music you make, the best (and unbiased) constructive criticism comes best from the one who knows what they make...and you make it better, or leave it alone]. Also, when you know certain things about music, you can better appreciate other good music despite genre or style, and yes, even artist.. >.>

About the 'truth'...
[Trent, you know what to do, without knowing that you know what to do!] All the things you mentioned above shows you're meant to have the position you do in music. You've already been through the struggles of an aspiring artist, and all of what you've said[even things I left unquoted] is some of the best advice to give an artist of any degree to soak in[and educate the different ways and levels of success, and motivate them to want to find out more along those lines].
Change is inevitable, that's why I say knowledge is progression. Build on what you know, and add to it along the way. Good music never dies..
I still listen to Lady Sings The Blues...and I was born '86. You see?

-L._K.
[Liz.]
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Know your work before you get your hands dirty. And not everyone can handle the type of work at hand. Don't always rely on another's hand to get the job done..because sadly in the end, you're the one left with the stain on your shirt.]]> linux_kitty Music Thu, 30 Jul 2009 09:10:01 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,794075#msg-794075 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,794075#msg-794075 jayetheartist posted:
I just meant that you're asking a lot of questions about copyright and such that very likely a) few people here are likely to be able to answer for you and b) should be asked in a different thread.

If legal stuff didn't tie into this thread, and it wasn't important, I wouldn't have went on about it so much. This is actually probably the step that should come right before jumping into your marketing strategy, so it should be basic to this subject (I would think).]]> CyDs84 Music Tue, 28 Jul 2009 03:13:51 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,793866#msg-793866 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,793866#msg-793866
[screamingmechanicalbrain.bandcamp.com]

I also wrote a very silly myspace blog about the Death of Myspace, wherein I reference this thread:

[blogs.myspace.com]]]> reverendjohnw Music Mon, 27 Jul 2009 21:02:17 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,792810#msg-792810 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,792810#msg-792810 CyDs84 posted:
jayetheartist posted:
Dude, call a lawyer or something and have them explain copyright law to you.

It's not inherent for a musician to know anything about legal guidelines is it? It's a necessary part of marketing, and that shouldn't be tied into anything less than being practical on this subject.

I just meant that you're asking a lot of questions about copyright and such that very likely a) few people here are likely to be able to answer for you and b) should be asked in a different thread.]]> jayetheartist Music Mon, 27 Jul 2009 06:03:29 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,792430#msg-792430 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,792430#msg-792430
I agree with all of them - except i don't think all main stream artists have to sell out to their major labels - they just need to be savvy. For example U2 owns all their own copyright. I think if your goal as an artist is to reach the same kind of success as they have your best bet is to negotiate a short contract with your label and then if your first records experience the kind of success that Lady GaGa has had then you have some leverage to work with when extending your contract or shopping for a new label.

I think if you want to be huge you have to be confident in your abilities and fight for what you want in your contracts - if you want to own your copyright - don't settle for less. If you really have the potential to be a mainstream artist eventually a label will give you what you want.

that being said i'm not in the music industry at all. That's just my philosophy on life. Don't settle for less.]]> kaykay Music Sun, 26 Jul 2009 17:34:46 -0700 http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,792269#msg-792269 Re: my thoughts on what to do as a new / unknown artist http://forum.nin.com/bb/read.php?30,767183,792269#msg-792269
the only thing i would like to add is that i really like the way topspin handled david byrne and brian eno's new releases:

[everythingthathappens.com]]]> spinecraft Music Sun, 26 Jul 2009 13:58:19 -0700