Do you believe in UFOs, astral projections, mental telepathy, ESP, clairvoyance, spirit photography, telekinetic movement, full trance mediums, the Loch Ness monster and the theory of Atlantis?
 
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06/21/12 2:45 AM

falkor posted:
You heard something unsubstantiated from someone. Know what that's called?

*drumroll*

Hearsay!

Your own experience confuses correlation with causation, but you don't seem to have much regard for science anyway. Christ, next you'll be claiming that aliens built the pyramids.

nice of you to join our argument. no, hearing something unsubstantiated from someone is not called hearsay. look up the hearsay definition.


and no i'm not confusing correlation with causation. the only difference between what i'm saying and what riktor is saying is...i don't mind using my imagination to help form my opinions about reality. he prefers to wait and believe everything is not real until it's been proven with the scientific method. so, his outlook on things is a very 'playing it safe' sorta perspective.

because anyone with half a brain would realize most things...humans do not have a grasp on. we know very fucking little about the universe. so i try to use my experience and the experiences of others to help guide me...to the what the scientific method will be proving in the future. that consciousness can be transmitted, that are minds can move things, etc..


i

 

06/21/12 4:22 AM

Now, LB.. Why are you arguing with "ad hominems " and "emperical evidence"?
Have you not read enough of their posts on this board to not realize they are on a pre-programmed loop?
Always the same words, same defensive mechanism, same mode of operandi with a few sentences relating to the topic at hand. It is best to state your idea or thought clearly once in the discussion and avoid arguing with their response. Otherwise they proceed to take over the whole thread with their bad pop song that just never ends. Kinda like being trapped in an elevator while Ricky Martin endlessly sings he's Livin' la Vida Loca.
Just mind numbing torture.

 

06/21/12 6:51 AM

LobotomyBaby posted:
nice of you to join our argument. no, hearing something unsubstantiated from someone is not called hearsay. look up the hearsay definition.

Nice of you to start the argument in the first place. How tedious. I'll paste the goddamn definition from dictionary.com, since you were too lazy to look it up. This way it's perfectly clear.

hear·say? ?[heer-sey] noun

1. unverified, unofficial information gained or acquired from another and not part of one's direct knowledge: I pay no attention to hearsay.

2. an item of idle or unverified information or gossip; rumor: a malicious hearsay.

Gee, that's...exactly what I said it was! Imagine that!

posted:
and no i'm not confusing correlation with causation. the only difference between what i'm saying and what riktor is saying is...i don't mind using my imagination to help form my opinions about reality. he prefers to wait and believe everything is not real until it's been proven with the scientific method. so, his outlook on things is a very 'playing it safe' sorta perspective.

No, he prefers not put people's lives at risk due to the fantasies perpetuated by your ilk. That's the contribution to society that you've made. The difference is you make shit up, and he doesn't.

posted:
because anyone with half a brain would realize most things...humans do not have a grasp on. we know very fucking little about the universe. so i try to use my experience and the experiences of others to help guide me...to the what the scientific method will be proving in the future. that consciousness can be transmitted, that are minds can move things, etc..

The scientific method works on what we can know, not what we can't. Why I'm bothering talking to someone who believes the moon is made of cheese is beyond me. Maybe if I try hard enough, I can move you away from your computer with my mind so you'll quit spreading bullshit around and attacking others on the forum whose views are challenging to your own.

Rogue1 posted:
Now, LB.. Why are you arguing with "ad hominems " and "emperical evidence"?

I do believe we have an anti-intellectual here. Go on, appeal to those emotions! Others will flock to your side!

posted:
Have you not read enough of their posts on this board to not realize they are on a pre-programmed loop?
Always the same words, same defensive mechanism, same mode of operandi with a few sentences relating to the topic at hand. It is best to state your idea or thought clearly once in the discussion and avoid arguing with their response. Otherwise they proceed to take over the whole thread with their bad pop song that just never ends. Kinda like being trapped in an elevator while Ricky Martin endlessly sings he's Livin' la Vida Loca.
Just mind numbing torture.

Funny you should mention all that, considering your post contained absolutely nothing related to the topic at hand. Fucking hypocrite. Goodbye. the finger smiley

 

06/21/12 7:20 AM

Rogue1 posted:
Let's see.. Two things off the top of my head.

I lived half a country away from my family. One night I dreamt of my grandmother, she was a young woman in the dream with long hair (I had only ever seen her with short) and she was happy to see me, sat and talked to me about several things that were going on in my life and hugged me extremely tight before she left.
The next afternoon my mother called and informed me she had passed away that morning. My brother also had a very similar dream of her the night before. In it she was also a younger woman with long hair. My mother confirmed that my grandmother hadn't had long hair since she was in her late twenty's. He and I always felt she came to us in the dreams to tell us good-bye.

I lived in a house where there was some issue with the guest bedroom. It had formerly been a child's room of some previous occupant and no amount of painting could keep the red marker on the back wall of the room from seeping through to look pink. We kept the door closed to the room mostly. One because the dogs would stand in the doorway of it, when it was open and incessantly bark at nothing. And two, there were times when it was open that at some point the door would just slam, echoing all the way down the hall and rattling glass and things on shelves.
We learned several years later from a cop friend that the house used to belong to a police officer and his family. One day when he was out, his 9 year old son and his son's best friend snuck into the closet in the father's room, with the hidden key and pulled his gun case off the shelf. They took the gun back to the boys room (my guest room) and in playing around, the friend shot the son in the face and killed him. Turns out it was not permanent marker seeping through the paint at all.
I am not saying there was a ghost in that room. But it seems some impression of what happened in there was left on it. Enough that the dogs could easily detect it.

*edit- I wanted to explain that this pink (marker) that couldn't be painted over was just splotches and little dots here and there clustered on the wall. What appeared a nuicence and nothing more. I do not want to give the impression it was some bright, glaring bloodbath of stains like some Amityville "Get out now!" story. I nor any of my guests ever felt anything odd or wrong on the room. Only the dogs refused to enter it.

Damn.. Looks like I contributed to this thread something on topic afterall.

 

06/21/12 8:43 AM

Rogue1 posted:

*edit- I wanted to explain that this pink (marker) that couldn't be painted over was just splotches and little dots here and there clustered on the wall. What appeared a nuicence and nothing more. I do not want to give the impression it was some bright, glaring bloodbath of stains like some Amityville "Get out now!" story. I nor any of my guests ever felt anything odd or wrong on the room. Only the dogs refused to enter it.

Little dots clustered on the wall that seem to come to surface... could have been mold, did you lick them at any time?

 

06/21/12 11:13 AM

Somehow I did not find them appetizing enough to stick my tongue to. However, mold is a possibility as well.

 

06/21/12 7:50 PM

Rogue1 posted:
Somehow I did not find them appetizing enough to stick my tongue to. However, mold is a possibility as well.

You're self control is admirable...

 

06/21/12 8:49 PM

Rogue1 posted:
Damn.. Looks like I contributed to this thread something on topic afterall.

Good. Let's have a read, shall we?

posted:
I lived half a country away from my family.

Isn't it rather interesting how all ghost stories start this way?

posted:
One night I dreamt of my grandmother, she was a young woman in the dream with long hair (I had only ever seen her with short) and she was happy to see me, sat and talked to me about several things that were going on in my life and hugged me extremely tight before she left.
The next afternoon my mother called and informed me she had passed away that morning. My brother also had a very similar dream of her the night before. In it she was also a younger woman with long hair. My mother confirmed that my grandmother hadn't had long hair since she was in her late twenty's. He and I always felt she came to us in the dreams to tell us good-bye.

I am not convinced. Here's why:

Dreams more often than not evoke negative emotion. Anxiety is the most common, followed closely by abandonment, anger, and fear. These dreamstate emotions are compounded by real-life stress. You were far from home with a loved-one close to death. It is not unusual, then, to dream of your grandmother, and the same would go for your brother.

Then, there is the issue of memory. We oftentimes will remember emotion felt during a dream much longer and better than we do the details of our dreams. The mind tries to fill in the gaps, to make a memory of the dream. No doubt you don't recall the dream exactly as it happened, nor does your brother.

I'm not saying you're lying. We all do this, to a very large degree, especially in stressful situations. Memory is easily altered and manipulated by others, and easily confounded by factors present during encoding. This why many psychologists have spoken out against the reliability of eyewitness testimony.

While you no doubt disagree, the story fails to exclude these as possible explanations, and therefore fails to "prove" telepathic communication categorically.

posted:
I lived in a house where there was some issue with the guest bedroom. It had formerly been a child's room of some previous occupant and no amount of painting could keep the red marker on the back wall of the room from seeping through to look pink.

What type of paint did you use? Oil-based? Latex-based? Clay-based?

What sheen did you use? Gloss? Semi-Gloss? Eggshell? Flat?

Did you prime first? If so, what kind of primer did you use?

Painting over stains isn't a simple matter. The paint you choose must be able to adhere to the stain as well as the material behind it. If you chose the wrong paint/primer combination - and there are many - then the stains would certainly continue to show, no matter how many times you went over it.

posted:
We kept the door closed to the room mostly. One because the dogs would stand in the doorway of it, when it was open and incessantly bark at nothing.

This isn't helpful, either. Unless you can speak the language of dogs, then you cannot be sure precisely what was holding their attention. Dogs can see only in black and white, and their senses of sound and smell are far superior to our own. Whatever they were barking at may very well have been invisible to you, yet completely natural.

My cats will sometimes stand beneath the vent in my bathroom and meow at the ceiling. That doesn't mean my HVAC system is haunted.

posted:
And two, there were times when it was open that at some point the door would just slam, echoing all the way down the hall and rattling glass and things on shelves.

Can you rule out negative pressurization?

In my college dormitory, the air pressure inside the building could be come so intensely negative the air currents inside would slam heavy fire doors closed.

Again, not ghosts. Simple physics.

posted:
We learned several years later from a cop friend that the house used to belong to a police officer and his family. One day when he was out, his 9 year old son and his son's best friend snuck into the closet in the father's room, with the hidden key and pulled his gun case off the shelf. They took the gun back to the boys room (my guest room) and in playing around, the friend shot the son in the face and killed him. Turns out it was not permanent marker seeping through the paint at all.

Did you have the stains tested by a medical professional? If not, then I would contest you don't actually know the stains were blood.

Dried blood, incidentally, is not red, but black.


Both stories raise more questions than they answer. By no means would I consider either "proof" of the supernatural.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/21/2012 09:29PM by Riktor.

 

06/21/12 10:26 PM

Riktor, I am going to answer you here and even agree that the scenarios you hypothesize could be correct.
And yet..

You chose to respond to your own selective reading. And that hon, is where your problem typically lies.

Not once did I claim either story was "proof" of the supernatural. They are simply out of the ordinary occurances that could possibly be.
Also, I pointed out that I was not saying that there was a ghost in that room. That neither I nor my guests ever felt anything on toward in there. I also explained that the marks were splotches and dots that were just a general nuicence. I even willing agreed they could have been mold.

So you have typed up this usual long litany of arguement to specific parts of my posts whereas in the whole of it, there was never any arguement. Tis a bad habit you have.

 

06/21/12 11:53 PM

^ i concur. this thread is about if you believe in such things not if you have proof of them.

edit: riktor i think we all know you don't believe in that which isn't scientifically proven.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/21/2012 10:54PM by smllyjlly.

 
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